New Anti-Abortion Tactics

[neadods]

I'm about to link to an article from Montana, so before people say "that doesn't affect you," yes, I know this isn't my state or even my coast. But link I shall, because I think we're seeing the opening of a new set of anti-abortion tactics.

The new GOP-led state legislature has unveiled eight new abortion-related bills they want drafted. These include:

- Rep. Keith Regier of Kalispell, to criminalize the death of an unborn child. God help you if you miscarry and can't prove it, ladies!

- Sen. Jim Shockley of Victor, to require girls younger than 16 to get parental permission to have an abortion. It sounds so reasonable and family friendly. Have I ever mentioned that I personally know someone who was knocked up by her own father at age 15?

- Rep. Wendy Warburton of Havre, to amend the state Constitution to define a person by declaring that human life begins when an egg is fertilized. See my first comment

- Rep.-elect Alan Hale of Basin, to revise health laws regarding abortion. Because, according to news reports in other states, "life and health of the mother" is actually MEANINGLESS because doctors can just decide shit like that on their own without getting antiabortionist input. So God help you if that pregnancy goes wrong, ladies, because health and life exceptions shouldn't be made.

- Rep. Cary Smith of Billings, to regulate family planning and abortion clinics. Regulate... how? Heath and life actually have legal meaning; does "regulate"?

- Rep. Pat Ingraham of Thompson Falls, to require women to have an ultrasound before an abortion. Been passed before. Known to add to stress and distress. I haven't heard of any occasions where it made a woman change her mind, though

- Sen. Jeff Essmann of Billings, to create the crime of obstructing a protest at a health care facility. The money shot, people. A crime not to obstruct the clinic itself, but to obstruct the protest. Like, say, escorts taking patients past the people shoving things at you. Escorts talking to you to drown out the shouts. Escorts standing between patients and cameras. I've done all of that. ALL of that, including blocking with my body. And now someone wants to make that illegal.

- Rep. Mike More of Gallatin Gateway, to provide abortion screening to prevent provider negligence and patient coercion. Another standard, meaningless bit of propaganda. It sounds so reasonable - and yet how are these to be measured? By what standards? Especially 'patient coercion' - neither the doctors nor the escorts go grabbing women off the streets nor block their exit once they go into the clinic. There have been some heartbreaking cases where a woman goes into the clinic and comes back out almost immediately and then sits in the car for a long time, arguing/talking/crying with whoever they went in with. You think we all don't know what's going on? Sometimes they go back in. Sometimes they drive off. You know what NEVER happens? Nobody pulls them back in. None of the escorts argue with them or even talk to them unless directly addressed... it's our job in those cases to make sure that they have privacy and that the protesters don't start pushing their literature right up against the car or come into the private parking lot to shout at them. We know it is a CHOICE, we know the choice isn't easy, and we know that it's not our right to make that choice, just make sure that the legal options remain open.

So don't talk to someone about 'patient coercion' if they haven't stood in a fucking parking lot trying not to cry because someone is hurting THAT MUCH and you can't do jack shit about it... except literally and silently stand with your back to them between them and the person shouting "BABY KILLER! DON'T KILL YOUR BABY! JESUS LOVES YOU!" Who's doing the fucking coercion then?

Comments

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

Forgive me if I've got my numbers wrong, but aren't the majority of miscarriages so early on in pregnancy that the woman in question may not even realise she'd conceived? I mean, are they really going to prosecute women who may not have even known they were pregnant?

These laws are just stupid. Absurd and stupid.

[lagilman]

Speaking as someone who miscarried in the first month of a pregnancy she didn't even know about...yeah. But "absurd" means nothing to someone who thinks the way these people do - it's all for God and Sperm.

Nea, permission to link this?

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

It just seems so ridiculous to me.

(Disclaimer: I live in the Australian state that made abortion legal on request in 2008. Then again, the state also had Australia's only abortion clinic murder, so...)

[neadods.livejournal.com]

It is ridiculous and cruel and has "saved" no one that I've ever heard of. I hear plenty of "I regret my abortion" stories from the protesters (we call 'em IRMAs), but I have yet to hear one, not one person standing in front of the microphones in front of a clinic saying "They kept me from going inside there and now I'm so glad."

If blocking women from clinics worked, wouldn't there be tons of those stories? Women rushing to say "I was prevented from an abortion and I'm so relieved"?

[freyaw.livejournal.com]

South Australian here. Technically we're only supposed to be able to access abortion in cases where the life, physical or mental health of the woman in question is in danger. In reality, it's available on demand, for free.

Sooner or later, the legislation will catch up and get in sync with the reality. Or so I prefer to believe.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

Technically we're only supposed to be able to access abortion in cases where the life, physical or mental health of the woman in question is in danger. In reality, it's available on demand

Bizarrely, that's what people are arguing *against* here - "The law says health or life! But that can be defined as anything so it's just the same as abortion on demand!" (Mental health isn't considered. The only time mental health gets a mention here is when religious people try to shove "post-abortion depression" into the lexicon. So far the accredited psychiatric boards aren't biting.)

[freyaw.livejournal.com]

IMO you will never stop all people from doing what is best, in their opinion, for them. You can make it difficult and dangerous, but all that proves is how little YOU care for them.

By making it (abortion) available, we are ensuring that women get care when they need it. Our emergency departments don't have to deal with the aftermath of (extremely) unsafe practices.

I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir here :) but knowing that these services are available, should I need them, makes me feel safer and more confident. It gives me a fraction more confidence that my government and medical care system does actually care about me.

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

Sooner or later, the legislation will catch up and get in sync with the reality.

It did in Victoria, so there's still hope for you guys. It hasn't been in the media at all lately, so I think that aside from the usual suspects, the population is happy with the change.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

Link far and fast.

[faireraven.livejournal.com]

I'm trying to find the study, but I remember seeing somewhere that somewhere between 50%-75% of pregnancies end in miscarriage, just that the woman is unaware the fertilization even happened in many of them.

Imagine all those women going through IVF where it "doesn't take". I know more than one woman who has gone through IVF, where multiple embryos were created, but never implanted. It's obvious she *WANTS* the baby (or she wouldn't be spending that kind of money), but would she be prosecuted for it now?

For that matter, what happens with "snowbabies", those frozen embryos that are left over from IVF procedures? Will it be considered murder to eliminate those never used?

Slippery slope does not even begin to cover it... I am reminded of a friend of mine whose baby was diagnosed with renal agenosis last year... The baby had no kidneys and would not survive more than hours after birth. It is difficult enough to have to make the choice to terminate, but now they would force someone to carry to term because her health isn't important enough to carry again?

[lagilman]

A friend of mine refers to this as "The White Man's Fear" -- they see the growing racial imbalance and want to make sure white women - who historically have had better access to birth control decisions -- have no choice but to build up the level of white babies in the land.

If so, this is even more chilling than 'just' religious fervor. Also, more disgusting (I can see, if not understand, the 'every life is sacred' belief. The 'every white is sacred' freaks me the fuck out.

[starcat-jewel.livejournal.com]

I've been told (but don't have any hard data to prove it) that abortion clinics in majority-black neighborhoods are rarely terrorized. That would tend to support your friend's assertion, if true.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

That's starting to change - there are now posters (and antis shouting) that abortion = black genocide, that Margaret Sanger was a racist, and thus the caring, kind, appropriate reaction is to block abortion of minority babies.

[museclio]

Don't forget - it's usually the white men talking about the Black genocide.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

We have mostly women since Pamphlet Guy moved away, but yeah. I do find it completely hilarious that white protesters are accusing white escorts of racism.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

At the March for Women's lives, one woman came storming off the sidewalk to shout at me that her son had had to go to Korea to adopt because "white women had aborted all their babies."

However, what I've seen more is the need for the militant radical fundie to outbreed the atheist (see "quiverfull") rather than white women.

However, the big push now, as I say to Starcat, is to label abortion as "black genocide" and try to eliminate it for minorities. Eeyore has accused us escorts of being racists for ushering minority women into the clinic, she has screamed "Black genocide! They commit black genocide in there!" at women of color.

There are also billboards going up in Alabama and Wisconsin (of all places!) with the same message. PolitiFact Wisconsin crunches the numbers of abortion rates here

[neadods.livejournal.com]

would she be prosecuted for it now?

Arguably yes, if someone really wanted to get their knickers in a knot about reckless endangerment of a child, in that if the odds are bad enough to miscarry and blastocyte=baby...

now they would force someone to carry to term because her health isn't important enough to carry again?

There's no "now" about it. There are plenty of arguments that "health of the mother" can be defined too loosely and thus should be eliminated from the laws.

And if her health is damaged enough to prevent her from carrying again... well, it's all God's will anyway. (Sorry, I know you're religious and I'm not trying to be mean. This is what is actually being said, including to my face by Eeyore. Her beliefs in what she thinks God wants trumps everyone else's rights, period, in her head.)

[faireraven.livejournal.com]

I'm religious?

*blink blink*

Husband can be, I'm a non practicing agnostic (don't know, not going out of my way to find out).

And yes, I've had friends who have been told it's all part of God's will, God's plan, etc... Feh. Sorry, but if you want to say it's part of God's will, then so is the education of people to actually know how to do this.

I have heard more women be victimized by "god fearing persons" in the name of *shaming* them for having miscarriages... *ptui*

[neadods.livejournal.com]

Oh! Sorry, thought you shared Hubby's sentiments. As for mine... *points to icon*

[faireraven.livejournal.com]

Hubby's been getting less and less sentimental. *smirk*

Me, I've always been "take it or leave it, but don't force me to do it." Since he's never had a problem with this, there is no issue. ;)

[neadods.livejournal.com]

aren't the majority of miscarriages so early on in pregnancy that the woman in question may not even realise she'd conceived?

As I understand it, yes. But like most anti-abortion laws, it only looks like it's protecting the innocent babies. What it actually *is* is criminalizing sex... but only for women.

[blueeowyn.livejournal.com]

It used to be that most people didn't know for sure they were pregnant but it is becoming a LOT more common. Back in the day (when my mom was pregnant with me), you couldn't go to the doctor to be checked until you had missed 3 cycles which would be about 2.5 months post conception.

My SIL would track her ovulation (oh, I'm ovulating, we need to go home right now ... at the dinner table) and would know that her period was due on Saturday and start taking EPT tests before that Saturday. I remember one time when she took the EPT on a Friday, found out she was pregnant, then miscarried on Saturday. If she hadn't taken the test, she would have had no idea she was pregnant (since I gather the period was fairly normal for her).

The new tests can track HCG in the urine at really low levels, they can advertise about "knowing before your period" and be accurate. I think they are now reasonably accurate a couple of days ahead of the date of the period (depending on the health of the conceptus etc.). Still have some false negatives but getting accurate positives (and the so-called false-positives are either because the pregnancy fails even earlier OR the person is on medications that read as HCG or they are on HCG to support the pregnancy).

[neadods.livejournal.com]

I remember one time when she took the EPT on a Friday, found out she was pregnant, then miscarried on Saturday.

Oh, that must have been devastating!

[blueeowyn.livejournal.com]

It was hard on her and I wondered why she was taking the EPTs so often. But her choice (she had several miscarriages over the years from 12 days post conception to about 2.5 months post conception). She currently has 3 children and after having the third had her tubes tied since she had the 1 of each then.

[alfreda89.livejournal.com]

Medical folk used to say that a third of all pregnancies ended in miscarriage during the first ten days of the pregnancy, generally long before the mother ever knew she was pregnant.

I think it's Brazil where laws like this already exist. The rich leave the country for an abortion. The poor die from illegal abortions. That's what these people want, because only bad people have abortions. They would be stunned to find out how many people picketing with them go inside, have an abortion, and then go back out and picket some more.

Here's why I will never vote for a party with an anti-abortion stance -- sites like this one -- http://www.aheartbreakingchoice.com/index.html . This happened to an extended family member of mine, and she could not get an abortion in three states. And she had medical connections. I wrote about that for Friends, back in 2009.

Spread this far and wide....

[flaviarassen.livejournal.com]

I had a miscarriage after less than two weeks - & had consequences that lasted for a year in & a half. If/when these laws go into effect, I am going to turn myself in & demand I be prosecuted.

[wendymr.livejournal.com]

This is outrageous. I know it's all been said before: treating women as uteri on legs, valuing a woman's life less than that of her unborn child - even caring less for any living children she may already have than for something that is still a mass of cells, and so on and so on. Not to mention that none of these hypocrites would lift a finger to help mother or child in any way, other than force the woman to give birth regardless.

Do any of these offensive proposals have the slightest chance of becoming law?

[neadods.livejournal.com]

Do any of these offensive proposals have the slightest chance of becoming law?

Running down the list:
- miscarriage = crime: Once passed in state legistlature, defeated by judicial review (I forget which state). Can probably never pass due to problems of determining difference between miscarriage and willful abortion.

- parental permission: Already passed in several states, sometimes with fiercely fought clauses allowing the minor to bypass parental control with a judicial review

- Life begins at conception: Often launched by conservatives, never even made it to bill status. Can probably never pass due to inability to know when conception actually has happened until embryo implants. Fiercely fought because it will also outlaw several current forms of birth control as " causing abortions" (including the pill, the emergency pill, and the IUD). Mind you, plenty of antis are making that anti-contraceptive argument already; once you put limits on abortion, the next step is to start expanding the definition of abortion.

- Health laws regarding abortion: too vague now to know what is or is not possible; depends on the precise law's wording

- Regulate family planning/abortion clinics: vague but not impossible; some states have passed rules allowing abortions after a certain time period that is stricter than Roe v Wade's timetable, or mandating that clinics have specific sizes of hallway, equipment, etc. So, possible.

- Pre-abortion ultrasound: Already passed in other states (see my orange line/feminist tags) Sometimes the type of ultrasound is even mandated. So not only possible but probable.

- obstructing a protest: A bill might be drafted, but if the judiciary doesn't strike it down based on current guidelines regarding protests (of which there are so many in this country - I'm not being sarcastic, there are lots of rules regarding this) then it's going to be open to a First Amendment battle royale, on the basis that counter-protesters get their say too, as do people avoiding harassment and intentional causation of emotional distress.*

- Provider negligence/patient coercion: Going to depend on the wording of the law. Currently there are clinic regulations, and how is coercion going to be defined? Unknown.


*Westboro Baptist - Fred Phelps and his merry band of anti-gay bullies - have argued before the Supreme Court their right to protest funerals, vs the father of a soldier claiming intentional causation of distress and harassment. I'm convinced that that decision, when it is handed down, is going to have an impact on clinic protests and how they're handled.

[museclio]

yeah - they like to require a goddamn vaginal ultrasound...

[freyaw.livejournal.com]

And those hurt. Or at least the one I had when I was still bleeding 30+ days post-D&C due to a missed miscarriage did. The things they use have no give to them :-(

[redpanda13.livejournal.com]

I read the Montana article at the link you gave, and then the comments on it. Almost all the comments were about as scornful and disgusted as ours. That's not to say a majority of Montanans agree with us, but it was a bit reassuring. I think a lot of times Republican pols wave the banner so they can point to what they've said or introduced without any real intention of pushing to get this stuff into law. Even so, it's nasty to have this stuff floating around; even raising it pushes the whole discussion in their direction.

[paratti.livejournal.com]

Horrifying.

[suze2000.livejournal.com]

These people need to worry about their own lives and not theoretical babies which may or may not ever be born anyway. Sheesh.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

I honestly think that Eeyore (our loudest and most unhinged protester) believes that she is getting brownie points from God every time she comes out. It's not a protest, it's a mission. And a martyrdom. Remember, this woman thinks that she is facing down Satan personally every time she talks to an escort.

[suze2000.livejournal.com]

Have you thought about wearing little horns? *snicker* Oh no, I guess that wouldn't help the people you are trying to escort. But it's funny to imagine her reaction when she spots them.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

I know you're joking, but I've watched Eeyore escalate from praying silently on the sidewalk to launching into the parking lot at a client. The day she stops caring what happens to her is the day she goes out in a blaze of glory, and I don't want to be the one who triggers her.

Besides, I wear sunglasses on shift, which is proof enough to her that I fear the light of God. Yes, she has actually said that. It's not like she needs horns to demonize us.

[suze2000.livejournal.com]

Or... you don't like squinting at that sun.

I shudder to think about how the people close to her cope with this level of religious mania.

[redpanda13.livejournal.com]

Well, here's a whole new ballgame. The Times of London reports a new blood test for a pregnant woman that will detect almost any genetic problem with the fetus.... This makes it easier and safer than amniocentesis, and will presumably be used more often. It's also very expensive, but will be cheaper in five years.

Link, but they charge:
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/health/news/article2837814.ece

[rovanda.livejournal.com]

My answer to the question of when life begins:

It becomes a baby instead of a fetus when it can survive outside the mother. It gets separate rights when it is separate from the mother - until then, it is *a part of* her, and subject to her rights.

If it can be given up for adoption, or into the care of the state, or even into the care of an anti-abortionist, that should be done instead of abortion. Until that point, however, a potential life should not be allowed to hold an existing individual's life and body hostage when she doesn't want it.

Now if only anti-abortionists were actually open to debate and discussion...