Where Religion & S&M cross

[neadods]

The childfree groups, of all places, are commenting on the battle to get a 'correction tool' called The Rod off the market. The maker called it safe and the "ideal tool for child training."

Now, I'm neutral on the subject of corporal punishment. There are times when I think a child needs a whop or two, but there are also things that I think should never be used against another human being outside of a well-negotiated scene in an S&M dungeon.

'Cause I saw the picture and, rod-maker dude? That thing is a cane. Safe my ass. If there's one thing they teach you when you're just starting out as a newbie little kinkster, it's how not to hurt yourself when you play with the mean tools. Canes are mean. They're second only to whips as "great ways to get seriously hurt when you play with hitting tools." Worse, that's a flexible cane. Know what happens when you swing a non-flexible cane too hard? An ugly bruise. Know what happens when you swing a flexible cane too hard? Running blood, and probably a scar.

And someone out there made money putting those in the hands of someone who had no training to be used on a child. Hiding behind a Bible to do it. "Suffer the little children to come unto me" indeed.

Let me put it this way - would you be horrified to hear of an adult whipping their child with a riding crop? Because that's what The Rod is - a riding crop, stripped of its protective/cushioning covering and with a soft, cushy handle. Because heaven forbid someone hurt themselves while they're hurting someone smaller than them.

Also, that whole "hand as an object of love" quote? I called bullshit when I first saw "hands must only pet" in a ferret newsgroup and I'm calling louder bullshit now. My hands do caress. My cats know that, and butt against them begging for a scritch. But my hands also pry open jaws to insert medicine, clip claws, run through fur checking for skin problems, lift off the ground. Just as my Mother's hands stroked my hair, patted my back, held me down to iodine cuts, grabbed me and yanked me roughly back from danger. Even if you never smack, sometimes hands have to hurt to help.

And still, after clippings, carryings, force feedings, and shoved-in-carrier-ings my cats nudge my hands for attention.

James Dobson, do you really think children are dumber than my cats?

Comments

[lagilman]

Riding crops can and have been used to beat adults to death. Without meaning to, just in the rage of the moment.

Think about that. Think about what it could do to a child. Especially a child too frightened/brainwashed to fight back.

I hate people.

Mixed feelings

[http://users.livejournal.com/_nymphette_/]

Well, I am not about physical abuse. I am not about whippings in ANY fashion, spoon or otherwise.

But I was spanked, and so was my sister. When we did something REALLY BAD, like a 5 year old stealing bubble bath from the store (me). Or my sister pushing a little girl into the street at 6. Or Throwing a ROCK at a little boys head (Me, 7) - Mom and dad brought us up stairs, and told us we were going to be spanked because we had hurt other people or done something really wrong and we knew it. And then I was bent over mom's knee, and had my bottom swatted twice.

No spankings past 7. Then we were old enough to ground from things. ; )

Mom spanked when we were toddlers too. Pulling down She even once bit my sister's arm once, when she had bitten me on the face and drawn blood. beth was a notirous bitter who had been sent home from pre-school for biting other babies, teachers... Mom didn't draw blood, or even leave a mark that lasted longer than a minute. Mammaw cried because 'Mom bit the baby'. But Beth never bit another person again. Ever.

I was never hit with anything but mom's hand(Oh! And Dad's once when mom was in KY). I knew the hand that spanked me was also the hand that did it ONLY because discipline is also an act of LOVE for a child.

that said? I am not divided on this 'Rod'. THAT is obscene. Ad one of the worst examples of religious 'abuse' that I have seen since the Chruch Of England translated Eph 5 with the word 'submission'.

*is enraged*

Re: Mixed feelings

[http://users.livejournal.com/_nymphette_/]

EEEP! lost train of thought there - second paragraph SHOULD say

'NOT pulling down our diapers or anything! ; ) But once, she even....'

That's what I get for multi-tasking!

[starcat-jewel.livejournal.com]

Thought the first: contact the lady running this campaign with the BDSM information. There's a good chance she doesn't know it, it's strong ammunition, and -- let's face it -- the opportunity to smear "The Rod" as a toy for perverts is just too good to pass up. Not to mention that it's about the only counter for "But the Bible says so!" that might have a chance of working.

Thought the second, after reading the article: the manufacturer describes himself as "one of these simple souls". I think he's right, but not in the way that he probably thinks he is!

Thought the third: My personal opinions about corporal punishment have undergone some changes over the years. I used to be against it under any circumstances. Having some close friends with very young children has made me less hardline; when a child is too young to use language effectively, there are times when a smack is the only sure way to get their attention. But I am still convinced that (1) no child should ever be struck with an object, only with the hand, and never hard enough to produce more than a mild red mark that fades in a few minutes; and (2) by the time the child is old enough for school, hitting as a punishment is no longer useful.

Striking a child with any kind of an object IMO is no longer "spanking", it's "beating" and should be addressed accordingly.

[lagilman]

I used to get spanked, as a very young child, and I was hit once, when i was a teenager and called my mother something that should never have come out of my mouth (and for the record? My mom has a seriously mean windup -- sent me right over the sofa. I think she was more horified than I was hurt).

A beating is not a spanking.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

A beating is not a spanking.

Exactly. If you want to really make yourself sick, reread the part where he said that it was merely "not recommended" for babies.

let's face it -- the opportunity to smear "The Rod" as a toy for perverts is just too good to pass up

If the article didn't say the thing was being phased out, that would be HILARIOUS! "Mr. Manufacturer. Please let me know if you have bulk sales on The Rod. We here at Paddles are delighted to know that there is a reliable, inexpensive cane on the market - leather companies always make us pay too much for our pervertables!"

Besides, those "Jesus candles" also burn cooler and cost less than those specifically kinky low-melt wax ones...

I think "Simple Soul" is shorthand for "I don't want none of yer book larnin' or facts or argeements tellin' me I'm wrong. I kin dew anythin' I wanna iffin I kin fahnd a Buybull verse fer it."

[starcat-jewel.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure whether you're agreeing with me or not, so I'm going to elaborate a bit on what I said. You are absolutely right, a beating and a spanking are entirely separate things. Unfortunately, far too many people get away with the former by labeling it the latter. Most of us who were legitimately spanked as children would never consider what these people are doing to be spanking -- they use the term specifically as a tool to minimize it, to make us think that they aren't doing what they are in fact doing, which is beating the shit out of their kids.

My definition of "spanking" is very specific. It involves use of the open hand only, target is the forearm or buttocks, no more than 6 impacts, and leaves no bruises or other marks that last more than 15 or 20 minutes. If you use your fist or any object, if you hit your child in the face or on the chest or upper back or legs, if you hit more than 6 times, if you break the skin or leave bruises, then you are NOT "spanking" your children, you are beating them. And while spanking (under my definition) is not child abuse, beating is.

[fiona64.livejournal.com]

I have a riding crop because, well, I ride. I accidentally whalloped myself in the leg with it once (don't ask ... I was trying to be clever and wound up being clumsy), and left a nasty welt.

BTW, the average cat has a brain the size of a walnut.

Dobson's brain is significantly smaller than that.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

I don't need to ask, I used to ride too. There was this old schoolie called Norman who just needed to hear the "whack" to move, so I used to crop my own boot.

Dobson's brain is significantly smaller than that.

BWA!

[theo-knight.livejournal.com]

Someone needs to check their biblical history and culture regarding the so-called "Rod of Correction" (TM). The rod referred to in the Bible is a shepherd's rod/crook/staff--used to guide and herd sheep and goats, not to beat them when they wander off. In a pinch it could be used in self-defense.

The phrase "Spare the Rod and Spoil the Child" does not mean that your child will be a spoiled brat unless you beat them into submission, it means that a child needs the guidance/counsel/loving hand of his/her parents (ie, the "rod") in order to turn out as a decent human being. Smacking them with what looks like a fiberglass antenna (or something the German police would use to subdue a perp) is definitely NOT the answer.

Sheesh! F-ing literalists!

[neadods.livejournal.com]

Someone needs to check their biblical history and culture

Why bother when someone will tell them what they want to hear and cherry-pick stuff out of context to make it sound all noble and right? /sarcasm.